40. Practitioner's Podcast: A Holy Instrument: An Interview with Jason Johnston

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Guess what guys? We've got a very special event happening here for the first time ever. We've got a guest Justin. Man we're doing it right then assist is new ground and we have somebody else other than me and you for people to listen to. So this should be thunderous applause in the background Justin would you introduce our guests?

Yeah. So our guest is Jason Johnston. who's a friend of mine works with the navigators. So he's actually with the collegiate side of the navigators. And we're really excited to talk to Jason not only about disciple-making but also about purity and some of the things that he's worked on a lot around what it means to be pure not only.

man but also a women as well. You know purity is a big thing for us as disciples. and it's something that can get us off track really quickly if we let that part of our life slip or if we're not being diligent with it. So Jason welcome to the podcast. Well thanks so much for having. Yeah no problem.

so like Tony said it's the first time we've interviewed somebody on the podcast. Tony does it all the time though on his other podcast reclamation podcasts. but maybe we just start you tell us a little bit about yourself and let's start with disciple-making. How were you first impacted by discipleship?

So being the first guest means this will be the best and worst interview you guys have ever done. So excited to participate in that that Lord. Yeah. So I grew up in a Christian home. My parents were discipled in their twenties and so they were just beginning to follow Jesus when I was born. And so they had me in great churches my whole life which I'm really thankful for.

But I met the navigators in college and that's where this idea of discipleship really became or really came into my life where a navigator staff during Bible study just looked over at me and said Hey you want to get lunch tomorrow? And that's kind of how it all began. And so the navigators were focusing on second Timothy two.

Where Paul says to Timothy the things you heard from me in the presence of many witnesses and trust a faithful man who be able to teach others also that's what the navigators were doing. So the guy who discipled me a man named Matt Laterno his mantra was teach them how show them how and then do it with them.

And so when it came to Bible study quiet time evangelism even discipleship I mean lead a guy to Christ and then start discipling him in college. And so Matt was really alongside me helping me do those things while I was in college and then hopefully train to meet to where I could do it the rest of my life.

And just for the just for the record to where did you go to college? Penn state university. Yup. So sorry to my own bio friends here. You got to have got hi guys on the podcast. So I had to bring it up because I'm predicting right now. Ohio state will destroy the state and the regular season match up.

I'm so excited. Let's go back eyes. I think that one's in Ohio. Isn't it? So it is it helps a little bit. It helps a little bit. let me ask you this Jason when when you think about disciple-making and about what Matt did to you as David did with you and for you how has that changed the way that you see God in the world?

Like how has disciple-making shifted and made you think about what Jesus did in the gospels? It really opens up the door for me to look around and say who can I am? Because Matt was just in my life and he said Hey I can help Jason grow. And some of these very specific areas and now as I'm in church and I'm in a neighborhood and I've got relationships that form in a lot of areas I can have that those same eyes and just say who can God now use me to help grow in their walk.

Now I do it. Full-time obviously now I work for the navigators. So it's what I've devoted my life to but it really opened up my eyes to see this is a calling that Jesus has given and it's something I can do. So prior to that Jason had had you been a Christian had you been in the church? What what had your upbringing been like prior to being in that Bible study and meeting Matt and being invited to that?

Yeah. So I was I grew up in the church. I was a Christian and wanted to follow Jesus. I've been saying that I wanted to be a missionary since about the age of 12 but what that actually looked like the practical day to day that was stuff I needed a lot of help with also through high school and college I had an addiction to pornography so there was a reality of significant sin issues that were going to hold me back from living out the calling Jesus had given me.

And so I need people to come alongside me and to help and to speak into those areas. So I was a Christian but really got taught how to engage in discipleship through the navigators. That's really cool. So was there anyone so prior to Matt and that Bible study was there anyone in your church or in your life that was trying to help you in a relational way?

Or was it more just engaging in services youth groups stuff like that? What would that look like? Yeah there really wasn't anything prior to college where somebody on a relational basis consistently was speaking into my life everything was large group. I do look back though a lot of youth volunteers that had a huge impact on.

That they really cared for us. They loved us. But in terms of the you know one-on-one discipleship that was not something I experienced until college with the navigators. Yeah. Oh well my my story is somewhat similar and our listeners have heard that before. Tony was impacted first in the army right?

As far as disciple-making. I really the first guy that ever really pour into me and one of one of the things that he did for me that that I'm I'm interested to get your thoughts on is you were very open and vulnerable about that pornography addiction. I'm curious what does that kind of accountability look like in disciple-making?

So so maybe there's somebody on here who's discipling someone who's got a a sin issue or character defect or whatever you want to call it. And they're walking alongside somebody what's the right way to address something that is both incredibly personal and intimate in that disciple-making relationship.

How did somebody attack in your. Well hopefully that discipleship relationship is the best relationship for that to happen. And so I think it starts with we've gotta be willing to ask the hard questions. It can be it seems sensitive. It seems awkward. But if in discipleship if we can't talk about what are you actually doing when you're.

What are you looking at on your phone? How are you relating to your girlfriend or boyfriend physically? What are your boundaries? Those are real life issues. I think discipleship is the number one relationship where that should be happening. And so I think first of all it's just we gotta be willing to ask let's dive in.

Let's let's see how our disciples are doing. Don't assume that sexual integrity is something they're automatically doing awesome app because they've never brought.

So in your work now you work with college age guys all the time. is this like conversation one? This is conversation two. Are you like I were like okay well let's talk about lust and porn. Right? Cause it's pretty much everywhere. So it's not conversation one for me there probably are some people that do that but in the culture we have in our ministry it comes up a lot.

We invite every freshmen men and women to participate. Excuse me to participate in small group sexual integrity studies. So it's the type of thing that we just say Hey this is something we do. We talk about it's out there. Let's not have it be a taboo issue. So we're inviting everybody. But as I'm sitting down with with young men I'm just going to I share my story.

Hey here's what it was like for me. I was exposed to pornography at the age of 12. It was a huge stronghold in my life. Satan wanted to use it to destroy my life. What's that like for you? As they're growing up and they were handed digital devices at incredibly young ages. So I asked just asked the question.

I've I've had very few young men who have been insulted by that or have you know pushed against that. I mean if they're trying to follow Jesus and yet they're carrying this burden they're going to be crying out for help. They're going to want another man to come alongside them and to say Hey I understand what that's like and I can help you get to.

Now I know all three of us are passionate about the local church and the navigators want to walk alongside the local church. So I'm going to ask you a question that may be almost impossible to answer but I'm curious from your experience why do you think the local church has such a hard time tackling sex from the pulpit or sexual integrity from the.

So I think there's a few reasons we've allowed it to be a taboo. And so we something we don't want to talk about and that is compared to the world which is always talking about it. So maybe 40 50 years ago there wasn't as much. Being thrown at our young disciples as there is now. And so we just thought Hey it's something we can talk about a few times and they'll get it.

Whereas now the volume of the world has been ramped up about sex and sexuality. The second issue I think is for a lot of our leaders this is an area of significant struggle for them and therefore they don't want to bring it out into. And also if you don't feel equipped you're not going to want to ask a young man or women.

Hey how are you doing with pornography? If you really feel like you have no idea what to say if they say well yes I'm looking at porn multiple times a week. So there's also a lack of equipping when it comes to some of these things. I mean the Internet's not that old but it has radically changed what it means to grow up in a Christian.

It's not really a safe place anymore. We should assume that they are seeing and experiencing pornography and some of these other things. And so we can not continue to allow it to be a taboo subject. Hmm. Jason you mentioned that a lot of A lot of people just in general have been exposed to electronics at a super young age.

what's kind of the the norms that you've heard as far as how young are people being exposed to pornography that have been raised really in the digital age. Right. It's kind of tough to nail down some of those statistics but I think Barna is saying it's around the age of 10. And as I talk to parents I typically just say well are they in a public school?

If your kids are in a public school they're much more likely to have peers who aren't growing up in a Christian home obviously and who may have digital devices with them and can just show up go up to them and say Hey check this out. And I mean just put the phone in their face. So I tend to tell parents with public school kids that you need to be having this conversation at a very young age because they're going to be exposed to this stuff.

So with that early exposure it does predisposed people right. It moves him. It it ignites something maybe in in us. one of the things that I'm curious about is with people who are struggling with purity with pornography addiction how do you how do you handle accountability? So Here's just bluntly.

My experience of accountability is it's asking it's behavior modification right? Did you behave correctly in the past week or two? and. For me in my life when I've been held accountable on sin issues specifically I have not had much problem. just lying to the guy right now when I would have been younger.

Cause I feel like man if I'm I I know the sin that I send. And so if I'm willing to transgress that before God like I'm at a character level I don't have any issue just lying to the guy. And so so I'm really curious how. How do you see accountability fitting in and working and maybe your view and experience of accountability has probably been different than mine but can you just speak to that a little bit?

Yeah. I think what you're touching on is that we want to speak into other people's lives more than just did you do the one bad. Because if that's the focus of our accountability it is just going to be as you mentioned behavior modification. So we want to be asking specifics Hey how was this past week for you?

Let's talk not just about where there's some struggles but what were some positives? What were some things you're building into your life? What's your time with the Lord? Like and I want to get beneath the surface. So if a college student says to me yeah. You know I really struggled with pornography this past week.

I want to ask him Hey what was going on? What were you feeling in that moment? What's beneath that behavior. Let's not just try to stop a behavioral issue. Let's understand what is driving this? What are some of the routes? And so in our material that we use it is. Pushing them to understand what is beneath that struggle because we want it.

We want to apply the gospel to those deep heart issues. Things like loneliness woundedness things that they've experienced in their past. And so our accountability has to be more than just did you do the bad thing but how can I come alongside you and help push you toward following Jesus? like that.

So it's more of getting into motivation feelings what's happening in the midst of when that happened. and processing through all that. You mentioned some material that you use I'm sure listeners would be interested. Is that something you guys wrote or what what material you guys use in. So actually it's strategically over my left shoulder placement.

Yeah there we go. I've got to put the product there. So I've been using a study called the war of the soul. That is something that I wrote. It's an eight week curricul primarily geared toward men but I'm trying to tweak it a little bit to make it make the verbiage a little more. applicable to women as well.

A lot of overlap there with how our men and women are struggling but this study primarily helps them process their story their woundedness their pain and you know that's not something I invented. A lot of material is going to. Do that but I wrote this with my experience personally and then also with 15 years of leading small group studies with men on the issue of sexual purity.

So that's one I recommend. also there there's material the navigators you use a lot of different material. They have a study called rewire which I believe is available for non navigators to use. And. Yeah I don't know how much a curriculum you guys want me to throw down. I could give lots of examples of things that we could use but I'll tell you what we'll link to the show notes a war to the soul and make sure everybody's able to pick up a copy of that.

I think that'll make it good. a good jumping off point at least. And then also at the end we'll make sure that we give them your contact information. Cause undoubtedly if they stay on your YouTube channel they're going to see lots of really good resources. And I you know it's it's interesting to me you've been doing student ministry now for over a decade.

Well college ministry specifically. I'm I'm really curious. How have you seen college ministry change in those last you know and that timeframe what's different now than it was when you first started on campus. So some of the differences with college students you know sociologists tell us that they value safety above all else.

And just practically one way that that looks like you know we used to do Bible study we would meet freshmen and invite them to our house. They'd get in cars. They drive off campus. That began to work less and less. And part of the reason was they kind of wanted their little safe box of their dorm and the student area.

And so we had to pivot and push everything on campus to where they felt a sense of safety and security before they had a relationship with us. And you know now after a few months they're willing to come into our home. But there's also a greater career focus. So they also say that they value career above family identity which they are the gen Z was the first generation that chose career success as valued greater than their family identity which is really.

And we also talk about there's a sense of fragility with this generation. They've kind of been coddled a little bit because safety is that highest priority and most have never kind of been out there. They've never really worked a job. And so there is a sense of fragility with them as well and it takes courage to step out and share your faith.

But if if if they live in a culture that says Hey you shouldn't speak truth into anybody's life just let them you know you do use. That's your truth. So when it comes to advancing the gospel that's a significant challenge because they they feel as culturally they shouldn't actually speak into another person's life.

but what I love those are all negatives. We've got to give some positives here but what I love is that they have a huge heart to change the world. And so if you connect this vision of Jesus to go and make disciples from Matthew 28 I think they can get behind that really quickly. That's awesome. What does a practically speaking?

Right. So I haven't been on a college campus. Well honestly ever cause I went to school online. but what does what does college campus look like for you? You know this week? What's it what's it ministry in that setting? how do you walk alongside people when they want to be safe there they feel a little fragile.

You don't you don't really have full access or maybe do. I don't know what do we need to know? So really I think the college campus is an ideal setting to advance the gospel and for disciple-making you've got this critical time in people's lives where they're coming out from the influence of their parents.

And they're beginning to decide what do they. So I still remember as a freshman that first Sunday morning saying am I going to go to church? My parents aren't dragging me there. It's up to me now. And so it is an ideal setting where they're on the campus. There they're like sitting ducks. I mean and they can build relationships really quick.

They cause people are pursuing friendships. They want to know other people. And what I love about making disciples on the colleges that we can impact say we impact freshmen and sophomores. We give them some of the basics of disciple-making. They learn how to have a quiet time how to do Bible study how to share their faith.

Well by the time they're a junior they are also equipped to pass that on to the next generation of freshmen. So you begin to see discipleship in generations really quickly for those that really get behind it. And so we use some basic material. We use like the navigators to seven Bible study series. It has a lot of basics of discipleship scripture memory like the navigator's topical memory system.

So really I think it is pretty ideal. So so this week I'll have multiple small groups that I'll lead and those those will spark into one-to-one settings that I'm discipling students but then I want them to be passing it up. They've gotta be then giving that to another student as well. Jason one of the.

The things I've observed about the younger generation is some of the social media preferences are really different than than people like our age. Right. So they're not as much on Facebook. they're spent a lot of time on YouTube and you know as I think we mentioned already you have a YouTube channel.

could you share with us just a little bit. What that channel is how it was born how it's been developing and yeah just kind of help us understand where that's at and what what your strategy is with that in terms of discipling and helping people. So I decided to do YouTube in 2016 and that was driven partially by the reality that it had the highest concentration of young men teens and twenties they were using YouTube above any other social media platform.

And so as I get 18 year olds and I'm seeing kind of where they're at in their Christian life very few of them. Understand the gospel and can articulate that with any scripture most of them were struggling with issues of sexual purity primarily pornography. So I was hoping I could build a platform to give encouragement to young men before we get them on the college campus.

Now YouTube can be a little fuzzy with what it will push to. Younger people because of their safety standards which makes a lot of sense. And so it can be a little challenging for me to get the message of sexual purity to teenagers primarily but I was hoping I could give them some encouragement and some hope just where I was as a teenager.

I hadn't heard anybody talk about some of these issues but that was really what motivated it. Yeah that's awesome. And there Tony shared in a previous episode about his battle with pornography I was first exposed when I was five years old. and so have had that as a part of my life and history as well.

both Tony and I and and U2 Jason we have kids at home right. We're trying to raise them in a an environment that Knows who Jesus is and is willing to follow him. And to have that as a part of who they are what are some of the things that we can be doing and other parents can be doing that can kind of help them remain pier.

and just one more thing for you answered my my oldest daughter just went to her first middle school dance and I had her read a book that was called good pictures bad pictures. and just to be in the conversation with her. All right. Well what what does it look like with all this technology around to know boundaries and limits how to handle all that stuff but more broadly right?

So what are the things that we should be thinking about as parents? as we raise our kids So you're on the right track with good pictures bad pictures. I love that book. There are a lot of tools and resources that we can use to begin to walk alongside our children. So one aspect is we've got to be having the conversation way sooner than we think I would rather my children hear what pornography is from.

Before they get bombarded with it on a screen whether it's at our house or at a friend's house. So I want to be proactive there and understand that it's not a matter of if your children will see something like pornography it's really a matter of when unless you are growing up in a cave. And so there's that aspect.

We've got to be having that conversation and we can't just have one comment. So if you say oh we did the birds and the bees when they were 12. Well there've been they're getting 20 so or so hours of media indoctrination a week. So think about the power of one conversation with your parents versus 20 hours of media indoctrination per week.

That's probably not enough. So this needs to be an ongoing conversation. The navigator is actually has some resources from NAF press to walk alongside your children with that is age specific. So my wife has been doing that with my oldest daughter and I'm beginning to think through as my son gets older.

Okay. What is the material that I'm going to use in his life? so they are going to need our presence. We're going to continue to need to ask them questions and to come alongside them. We can't pretend it's not a. And can you tell how old are your kids? Jason? I forget. So 10 nine and five. Okay. So you're not far from mine.

Tony's are a little older miner 11 down to five four of them. Okay. as you engage in those conversations already especially with the older ones how how are they responding? How are they handling. Well if you do the conversations early enough it's not awkward because they're constantly learning about everything.

So it's just one more thing that they're understanding. And so that's that's kinda what I like about it. It becomes normal. You know if you wait until they're 15 and they've already been exposed to all these things that's a very awkward conversation to have with your mom or with your dad but you kind of get that started to where it's it's a normal thing.

Hey we can talk about this. It doesn't have to be a task. Hopefully I'm not turning red in the face but this is this is just another example of something that we need to talk about. I love that idea of starting early. Uh we've we've started early. almost wish of it. Hasn't I don't know if it's been frequent enough or but it's I can tell my my oldest stepdaughter she doesn't like to be in the conversation.

So with the good pictures bad pictures I said well You're going to read it. I said and we can read it and have two or three conversations about it or you can write a book report for me and we can go from there. And she's like okay all right.

I like that. You know one of the things that we're hearing a lot from researchers like and those guys is that the next generation is really not interested in the local church. And I'm curious. have you found that to be true? And does that mean that they're not interested in and following Jesus like what what's the what's the trend looking like?

Is it it feels like to me that we're kind of inching our way towards this kind of post-Christian culture is does that align with your expense? Yeah. I think what Barna is telling us is that we have the rise of the nuns of a young generation that doesn't affiliate with any religious background. And that's true now I'm in the Bible belt.

So I might be a little I have a little bit of a different experience than where I grew up say in Pennsylvania. And what I would say is that we know that they're growing up in a Christian culture. That values sports academics career finances and security over following Jesus. And I think it doesn't matter what we say to them if their observation is that those are the most important things in life.

It's going to be hard for them to be tied down to the church as the highest priority in their life. So just as this is where I'm at with my children is my son going to find out that Hey if he has a soccer. On Sunday that we all skipped church and the soccer game takes preference to gathering with the local body.

These are the kind of the real life issues that I'm saying. I don't want him to get to 18 and think Hey sports are the most important thing rather for him to have that formation to say no we valued God. And we valued following Jesus above all else. And so what I see is that very few college students have had discipleship in the.

So what was modeled to them. And so that's probably what I would say as to why we're seeing them value that less. Hmm. Tony Tony let me jump in. So I'm curious hearing that Tony you're you're super involved in sports and with the Elks and not only the parental level but also like organizationally helping lead some of that.

how does what he just said fit. Yeah just how do you process all that? Cause I know you're doing it right in the midst and you are pastoring a church so it's not like you're you're not engaging both but what are you seeing from where you're at to me? Well I honestly I think it's living in the tension is probably the best way to say it from my perspective is is that it's really difficult.

You know the kind of relationships with the unchurched that we tend to do in sports. If you don't give up the cost of them to do sports. And so it's not uncommon for us to take a couple of weekends a year and go do a sports thing and miss gathering in the local church last year most of our vacation time away from my home church was for sports right.

And we went to a phenomenal baseball term and in Evansville but it's that hotel time that you know what we talk about on the podcast the with him time that gives us the opportunity to share our faith. And so you know As you often tell me Justin is that if we're intentional about it overcome I think we're most parents probably.

And where I tend to get into trouble is when I'm not intentional about pouring into my church pouring into my kids the importance of church and the essence of community in that. So it's definitely a tension for. Yeah I'd say beyond church what I love here and what you're saying Tony is that you're using that time strategically and you're modeling.

And but if you're not modeling and it was just Hey sports is the most important thing you know what I. What's really sad to me is when we do evangelism when we do outreach Christians are not saying different things than non-Christians. When you ask them spiritual questions. That's what concerns me the most.

So whether they were in church or not. So for example one of the questions we ask is why should God let you into heaven? Like what would you say to him and the Christians and the non-Christians. They both say well listen I've tried my best. I'm a good. And those that are saying Hey I'm a Christian. I grew up in the church.

Can't give you one verse to explain what they believe and why they believe it. And that's what we've got to see some formation and some discipleship of this younger generation that you know it's more than just while they were they were sitting in church. So therefore they got it. That's where discipleship and and I'm on your podcast.

So you guys know this but that's where discipleship can really make a huge impact. Yeah well honestly I think that next generation wants to be poured into an intentional ways. Right. And so that I've got more young men texting me questions about faith or moral dilemmas than than ever before because of what we're doing at the high school with fellowship of Christian athletes because they they feel safe.

Right. And it's it's time right time. Oh Love over time builds. Trust is one of the things they talk about in our our children's programming. Right? Like it's that's true in disciple-making too. That's awesome. So given that we go ahead Justin. Okay. so given now what you just said Jason as you work with younger generations and that's your primary focus what would you say to like older generations?

What could. What could they do like a we do to serve those who are who are coming up through college and maybe in their twenties. what what can we do? What do they need from us? Where are they looking for? So I am almost 40. I've been working with college students. I think I'm in my 18th year here and I am more and more convinced that the younger generation needs more adults in their life.

Now. Hmm. So as I've gotten older I haven't said to myself you know they don't they don't need me like no they need father figures. They need mother figures. They need godly men and women alongside of them. And so I would just say Hey dig in buy some pizza ask them questions. Don't be put off that you don't understand the media that they're consuming.

And you're a little bit confused about the social media. The stuff that's okay. Just dig in. they're created in God's image to have face-to-face relationships and they really crave it. And so just an example here recently in my life we had all of our freshmen women over a few weekends ago and they're just sitting in our living room.

They were doing a little workshop that my wife was participating in and afterward the one of the girls just said I just love being in your life. And that's kind of weird and there's nothing special about my living room. It's couches and you know a TV and a rug but they just want to be in a home. They want to see families.

They want to see adults living out what discipleship looks like. So I would just say Hey you can do it. Dig in you know get in there. I love that. because it's it's real fun life. As we begin to kind of close our time together. I'm curious. What what advice do you have around disciple-making if somebody's.

our listeners typically somebody who who loves Jesus who's trying to figure out what does it mean to make disciples as you look at the Christian who's involved but not yet committed to disciple-making what's one piece of wisdom that you can share with them around disciple-making either either getting started or you know persevering.

So I think the number one thing people say about discipleship is that they don't feel equipped. And I always say that's a great thing because what we're trying to do in discipleship is the thing that we can't do change someone's heart. God does that. We just show up. And so. I after 18 years of full-time ministry and discipleship I don't sit down and think oh I can do this.

I'm skilled. I've got what it takes. I'm just applying you know a few loaves and fishes and asking God to multiply and do this work in somebody's heart. It's the work that I cannot do. So don't be discouraged that you don't feel equipped. Dive in sit down with somebody watch God changed somebody. That's incredible.

That's incredible. I know our listeners are going to want to connect with you. what's the best place to jump in. Is there anything else that we need to know about your YouTube channel or the ministry? any places where we can send people? Yeah I think YouTube would be the best spot. It's a soul fire 2 0 9 on YouTube.

And that's where I'm trying to offer gospel hope for a porn filled world. I'm addressing issues of sexual integrity trying to encourage people that sexual integrity is doing. That's not easy but it is doable. And so I would say that's a spot to connect with me. I also have a website it's war of the soul.com that comes from first Peter two 11 where Peter says abstain from fleshly lusts which war against the soul.

That's where I put out most of my material. And that's where you can find that war of the soul study that I wrote. You can contact me. I can talk about how to get copies of that. If you want to try using it in your church or in your. Hey Jason I want to ask you this. What's the 2 0 9 part of your channel.

All right. So all right. So that comes from Jeremiah 20 and verse nine. And that is where the prophet Jeremiah he's ready to throw in the towel but yet he says if I say I will not mention God or speak any more in his name there is in my heart as. Burning fire shut up in my bones and I'm weary of withholding it and I cannot.

And so Jeremiah said he's got this message from God. He can't hold it in. It's going to come out. And I have felt that way when it comes to issues of sexual integrity it's the calling in my life. God's calling me to talk to the next generation of men and women to encourage them and to speak into their lives.

And so that's the soul fire comes from Jeremiah 20 verse. Well everybody. Thank you so much for gathering with us today Jason thanks for being on the podcast. We love it so much. We love to end with a takeaway and an action set. So the takeaway for today is it's never too early to start talking to the next generation about purity.

It's never too early to start talking to the next generation about purity and the action step. Do me a favor. Go subscribe to Jason's YouTube channel. Right now get the information you need so that we can start pouring into the next. And a godly way. Thank you so much for being with us today guys.